It came to my attention recently that Wally Hanks is still alive and kicking. He is best-known among youtubers, anonymous, and former Scientologists for being the guy that abused children while running a ranch for Scientology. He was interviewed recently, and the poster asked for a transcription. In the spirit of freedom of information, I am posting the transcription here as well as the original video.
U: User WH: Wally Hanks
U: Are you the Wally Hanks that ran the Mace Kingsley Ranch School?
WH: I started it years and years ago, I spent about half a million dollars (running it? cannot understand, he mumbles). U: I just wanted to ask some questions about the “Ranch”. I am one of the kids that were there. WH: What you mean? You couldn’t go through my program.
U: Yeah I did, down there on Avenue R-8 in Palmdale.
WH: Oh yeah Avenue 8 You know that was all done with my own money and my own time. It wasn’t really associated with the church.
U: But Debbie Mace running it, right?
WH: I did what I tried to do. It was chaotic, but uh.. but we did have we tried going to Sierras. Do you remember going to Sierras with us?
U: Yeah a bunch of times.
WH: Oh yeah we went a lot of places up there, sometimes we took courses sometimes we didn’t. We tried to learn wilderness skills.
U: Now I don’t want to give you a hard time, but I was sent to the Ranch to handle alcoholism, and there was a lot drinking going on every weekend.
WH: Well not every weekend, but you know.. I’m a (mime? wtf did he say?), I wasn’t a saint (laughing). I’m still a goddamn (mime? LOL). I’m still a trapper and a marine. There’s a lot of drinking going on in the marines.
U: So what do you think of Scientology now?
WH: Well Scientology didn’t do nothing for me, I did something for Scientology. We didn’t drink every weekend regardless of what anybody says, anybody says that they are fucking liars.
U: Have you heard the recording of you beating the kid on youtube?
WH: I don’t care about the internet, I don’t even have an internet. I’m dying anyway.
U: I’m sorry to hear that.
WH: Anyone wants to rub my name in the ground, rub it in the ground. Fact is I was discharged from the Marine Corps, and I’m a chaplain in the Unite States Marines. That’s the only thing I fuckin care about right now. Scientology and whatever them people are doing right now I really don’t care.
U: That’s good, that cult never did anything for anyone but themselves. Have you ever thought about speaking out. about how Scientology took all your money?
WH: Well you know they did take my money, it did cost me about a million dollars to get to OTVIII. I set that ranch up, that was my money that set that ranch up. Half million dollars. The fact is I did that for the love of man, I didn’t do it for the church or L Ron Hubbard, or anybody. I did it because I was raised in an orphanage. You know I got some really nice slick balls out of Seattle. They investigated all that stuff, and when i got out here at Edwards, they investigated it too. They said basically said, you know basically, I was a victim of circumstance. What really caused the ranch to go bad was that dumpin them fucking psychotic cases in there. I was told to run a kid’s ranch but they kept dumping them fuckin psychotic cases.
U: Did you ever have that brain injured kid named “Buddy” at the ranch?
WH: Yeah I remember Buddy, I remember Buddy, and Buddy did good until he set the wilderness on fire. That ain’t the psychotics I’m talking about, it wasn’t psychotic kids, it was psychotic adults. You know that they dumped on me out there, because the church don’t give a shit about them people. Once they get their money out of them, they’ll take them to just take them to anyone that’ll handle them. I tried to handle them, I tried to help them because that’s what I do, I try to help people (laughing), I’m still helpin people. I got 3 parolees on 2 bipolars at my little facility. But I’m aint charging anything. I never have charged anything. (4:11) The Ranch, I would say, that was a non-profit entity. A lot of people make a lot of money off that thing, but I never made a nickel off of it.
U: Did Debbie Mace ever get in trouble with the church, for all that stuff that went on? She was the case supervisor, right?
WH: Well I dunno, she got into hot water for a lot of shit. I didn’t hang out with debbie, or carol, or any of them people. The ranch was my property, my facility, and uhh my purpose was to show people survival skills. Try to deal with it, and they started dumping, you know, psychotic cases on me. It kinda (something) me a little bit. Right now I got psychotic cases, I learned a lot. I did OTVIII on my own dime. It wasn’t anything I earned off the ranch, cause that was a non-profit entity that cost that wound up costing me a lot of money. But I made it off my own ability. But I haven’t done anything with the church since ’99.
U: Well that’s good, things are going really bad for them right now. WH: I don’t give a shit about what they do, what they are. If they can make it happen, make it happen. If you can’t make it happen, then don’t. I didn’t like it because, you know, the bottom line is you had to do something for the person in front of you. That’s the bottom line. You gotta do it, you can’t charge ’em. People aint goddamn cash cows. I had a lot of disagreements with that, the expense of it and stuff. I kinda stay to myself, 62, just retired, some (wut?). And uh, going through a lot of surgeries and stuff. You know, I’ll be turning (cannot understand rest of sentence). They can bitch as much as they want, it isn’t going to make any difference.
U: Well I’m sorry to hear about your health problems. WH: Well, I’m old, I’m 63, you know, lot if injuries, lot of trauma, lot of this and that. But, goddamnit, I didn’t damnit I damn sure didn’t sit on my couch.
U: My parents are going through the same thing, and they are “OTVIII” too.
WH: Well, you know, the body is gonna get old. You know I spent 15 years in the marines. I beat all that shit up, then the railroad and stuff. It’s just surgeries, orthopedic surgeries and stuff. I’m not worried about it. Well, you know, I’m 63 and life span for someone that smoked camel cigarettes all his life and drank whiskey is probably 65 (laughing). I’m ready to go, I don’t give a shit.
U: So what do you do out in Edwards?
WH: We have a little facility out of here, if anybody wants to come out and interview me in person, they sure can. I’m chaplain of the Marine Corps and I’m commandant over Edwards Fleet out here. We got sailing boats and we teach Marines and Airmen how to sail. And we still go to (something) Basin and we still to go to the fuckin Mormons and I still teach these people how to do this stuff because that is who I am. You see? (laughing) These people are a lot smarter than the people I dealt with back in the 80’s.
U: You know, I always felt the ranch could have been really great for me, but all the “out ethics” that was going on there, really did more harm than good.
WH: Well when you got 22 people without ethics and one scummy asshole OT trying to keep it all (something)what the fuck do you think is gonna happen? Miracles?
U: There were only 8 kids with me ther in 1988.
WH: Yeah, well it went up to 22-23 then we had 6 adult psychotics. It went south pretty fast. But, nevertheless, I still paid for it.
U: So where did all the money go? Did Debbie Mace get all of it?
WH: Oh well they took their money off the top when they sent someone out, they’d take their money.
U: Yeah I remember my Mom writing a check to Debbie Mace for thirty-thousand dollars.
WH: That’s right, they’d pay me after their took their 40% off the top for nothin.
U: And no one got their money back? Even after things got out of control?
WH: Nah, they never gave me anything. I actually funded that whole program out of my own pocket. Because I was a writer, you know, at the time. (cannot understand last sentence)
U: Yeah I remember learning how to drive your 4×4.
WH: The purpose of the program was to teach people that if you make them able, grow up in the Sea Orgs, and they just kept dumping stuff and stuff and stuff, and you know, having too much stuff, going crazy, living in my own home. We went crazy. We never wanted girls, and they finally started sending girls out there. And girls are harder to deal with that boys. Lemme tell ya, they’re more clever, more sneaky..
U: I left just before the first girls came to the ranch, but I knew it would get out of control.
WH: You know that’s what happens. The fact is, we had a good program.. (end recording)
WH: Anybody else would have come out of fuckin Vietnam crazy. You know, we had a good program, a lot of guys call me and send me cards and letters and you know, it did save their lives. You’ve got Marco (blank) that calls me every month and Eric (blank) and a lot of the early guys you might know call me and write me and (blank). You know, it had some good successes and guys went on to be successful and maybe some of them didn’t, I don’t know.
U: What about Marco?
WH: Oh Yeah Marco, shit I got his number you ought to give him a call (laughing). And uh, he calls quite often, he’s actually fixing to come out here and visit; we’re gonna go sailing. Oh yeah, Marco and I went sailing quite a bit, we went out there maybe 15 times. I still got a stable to sailboats out here I used for the Marines at Edwards and uh, the airforce people. And uh, 1, 2 ,3 4 parolees and two bipolar cases I’m dealing with for the State of California.
U: So you’re doing for the State of California what you did for Scientology in the 1980s?
WH: The veterans, I work through VA. I’m a chaplain for the Marines. Uh, and I’m chaplain on base. So Uh, and uh it’s kind of like a veterans program, but anyone can get backed up, ya know? Particularly if you’ve got have mental issues and dealing drugs and stuff like that. Get in trouble, but all my guys are ex navy, army, or marine corps. The common denominator is they that they got on methamphetamine, and they got bipolar shit, or whatever the psyches call it but, you know it’s real and I gotta deal with it; psychiatric drugs and their counselors and their psychiatrists and stuff and.. What we do is we pull the plug (cannot make out rest of sentence). And I’ve got 8 trailers out here on the front row and I kinda run this trailer park. And I have them stay out here, and we work as long as it takes. They aren’t really paying me, it’s just something I do I because I like to help people. They are doing well, but you can certainly come out and visit! Yeah man, it’s north Edwards, we’re right off Highway 58. It’s called Edwards Fleet, for my clients. (garbled here) I am still using a little LRH tech but I’m also using other tech. I’m dealing with the psyches and uh, and uh the medications and stuff like that.
U: Have you tried cannabis at all for post traumatic stress?
WH: Well no, they get their medications from the psyches; most of them are on Seroquel and uh, things like that. You know, I just go with what their program is, and I monitor it. If I see bad things I report to the social services that, you know “this ain’t working”, and you know, you need to modify it. What have you. The rest of it is mess work, and sailing, and going to the Sierras and keying them out. Keeping the pace off them, like we do. And it’s manageable. I’ve got a navy corps man that helps me. She was a case herself, she came through the system, and we she graduated my little rundown program, she decided to stay on staff. It’s kinda like the old days, except of dealing with kids I’m dealing with the military (laughs). And Marines it’s a lot safer that way.
U: So that’s what keeps you going? Doing what you love?
WH: Well it is what I love and you know, one day I’ll die. Hopefully somebody will pick up the goddamn stick, because a lot of people out there need help. And uh, you know there’s a lot of opportunity to put a program together. Why do you come out and visit the program? And uh, lemme show ya. We got the same thing we had at the Ranch, except we don’t have any stupid horses and all that kinda stuff. We use sailboats, and RVs, and go out in the desert. We have campfires like we used to do when you were there probably. (cannot understand, 4:34) Every year, just like always. And I got some people that help me, I got the marines that help me, that’s the main thing. I got a lot of help from the marine corp.
U: Well if I am ever stupid enough to come back to California, I’ll stop by and tour your facilities.
WH: Well you do that, and if you know anybody that wants to talk to Cat and Wally, just give ’em my phone number. (laughing) I’m here till I die, and that might be sooner rather than later.
U: Well at least you got to enjoy YOUR life.
WH: I did, I’ve enjoyed life. It has been wonderful, there ain’t a day that goes by I don’t think about the wonderful things we did and some of wonderful people we had. Sure some of them were fucked up, sure I was fucked up, sure everyone is fucked up to some degree. But you know, what when you come together as a group, those are the things that uh, make the difference. I have photos on my internet, I got photos from all that stuff! You know, from the ranch days, to the fleet I put together in Seattle, from the fleet I put together here. You know, all those photos are there, and all the people I kept them on file. Ok mate, well, give my number out! Tell me give me a call. If anyone wants to come out, I’ve got guest quarters if they need to stay for a couple of days. We’re on our winter sailing program right now, and we’re gonna got to (something) cove. Then we got spring sailing ….